| Archive for Carp Addict Forum Carp Addict Magazine - For the serious Angler. |
| blondie |
improving your mixhi all.im really getting in to making my own bait.i have a basic balanced bait based on petes recipie(with the help of dean) .i understand the basics and importance of flaa,s,oils to use and some addatives to use for the carp to ivestigate(chemoreception,feeding triggers ect).i want to create and put my own "label" on my mix to get the very best from it catching wise and of course benefit to the carp.what are your thoughts on blending spices(eg chili,fenugreek amchoor)oil wise cod liver oil and sesame ect or any others that people could recomend or point me in the right direction. maybe sugars?many thanks.steve 
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| lucilastic |
Don't get into Sugars Steve.....
On this forum schadenfreude rules.....
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| The Hunter's Moon |
Blondie
Why label a good mix ?? I’m not sure that all these could be classed as labels as such As I tend to think labels as being flavours.. but maybe a few to play around with & mix together, some work better as dips like marmite… but nothing ground breaking……As I’m far from being an expert in the bait making game  ….But as with garlic some may add something else to your mix… .
Pete will properly have a few as he’s ancient…….  
Chilli Paprika Cayenne, Fenugreek Turmeric Asafoetida Garam masala Cumin Garlic Hemp oil Black pepper oil Gravy powders Sea salt Belechan Marmite N butyric acid Milk shake powders etc Sugars……. One for Luci me thinks……He loves Sugar……..
Fructose Black strap molasses..... by far the best bream attractor I have used 
Why some of them work thats when the headache’s start  try looking for common links
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| lucilastic |
Steve....the perceived wisdom is that since Carp do not produce
Insulin,a sugar regulatory mechanism,it therefore follows that sugar cannot be considered in terms of viability. Luci....Sugar.... .....Schadenfreude... See above..
Stick with the Alkaloids....
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| The Hunter's Moon |
Stick with the Alkaloids………. yep you will soon be reaching for them if you spend too much time in the world of bait science & big words
Luci Sugars… I have an open mind …….
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| lucilastic |
Chilli ..... Paprika.... Cayenne.... Fenugreek.... Turmeric.... Asafoetida...
Cumin.... Garlic.... Hemp Oil....Black Pepper Oil.... Common Link ?....... Alkaloids.... I am pleased at your open mind regarding Sugar... ..Because the perceived wisdom is Boll..ks.....
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| blondie |
label was probably the wrong word to use.i just want to make my bait a bit different by mixing spices and oils .i dont want to use a flavour.i do use belechan(only when the wifes out )also use molasses.should not of mentioned sugars :roll .cheers.steve
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| PeteB |
http://books.google.co.uk/books?i...;resnum=4&ct=result#PPA298,M1
Luci.... No insulin for a carp?? 
Sugars are important, monosaccharide and possibly disaccharide only according to my reading from a detection point of view...Polysaccharides appear to be a waste of space unless you can give me a pointer Luci...  Always willing and open to learn...
Labels... avoid obvious ones, ones that do not offer a food source, your bait will stand out, that is not the intention, get them eating it because they believe it's food and solely because of that... food signals are predominantly amino acids...
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| blondie |
hi pete.i know you have been interested in monosaccarides before(glucose,dextrose,fructose ect)glucose is an interesting one.its readily fermented by yeast producing ethl alcohol and carbon dioxide.i think there was a test somewhere where carp could detect carbon dioxide.i think ive read that right .is it worth putting extra aminos(minamino ect),even if your base mix has all the required or near enough aminos.does this give off a sort of saturated food signal .tell me if im going wrong  .cheers.steve
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| lucilastic |
Palatal chemoreceptors in carp are highly sensitive to Carbon Dioxide..
....So What?.... how is this utilisable ? ....
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| lucilastic |
I know a way.........
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| blondie |
would it be an investagate trigger.you have got me thinking lucilastic.go easy on me im only a learner .willing to learn though .cheers.steve
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| lucilastic |
Carbon Dioxide in water stimulates Palatal taste receptors....other than
those for acid.... Why?......
Well...perhaps it is not necessary to know why..... although several avenues of thought present themselves.... That it does is enough......
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| blondie |
how much glucose would you use in a bait.would it be worth while using it with yeast to create carbon dioxide for that effect on the palatal receptors? ..cheers steve.carbon dioxide does worry me though  .cheers.steve
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| lucilastic |
Your mind begins to expand.....
Good.....
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| The Hunter's Moon |
Pete
A/A’s another day when the Alkaloids have kicked in … Parts say’s yes but as you know I still have misconceptions ………regarding the passage of ……& the affects of water  ….It all seems to go back to -/+ at present
Luci The 'bacterial battery'
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| blondie |
some thought provoking info guys .i also enjoyed the garlic thread aswell.maybe a discusion on other ingriediants.anything that that would be of benefit to your mix.what would be your favourite addition?.cheers.steve
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| lucilastic |
What powers the battery?......
Steve....the Sodium salt of Glutamic Acid....
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| blondie |
can you get it from a chinese supermarket by chance luci .something used in in chinese cooking prehaps .cheers.steve
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| blondie |
what about bromelain?that looks interesting.cheers.steve
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| The Hunter's Moon |
What powers the battery?...... As if you didn’t know !!!!!
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| The Hunter's Moon |
what about bromelain? that looks interesting
Interesting maybe but not for me until the A/A p/H picture is clear (although they maybe part of the bigger picture), Enzymes seem very precise it the way they function from what I can gather to date . An understanding of how & why is needed before just chucking it in & hoping for an end result........
There are others who have the understanding of how to use……….But talk of Enzymes usually ends in Forum battles………. |
| blondie |
know what your saying hunters moon.bait can be a mine field.allways seem to be conflicting views.AA,s i can just about get my head around.ph still looking at and just touched on enzimes .google is a wonderfull thing.plenty of info along with some dead ends.some of the papers on the subject are really expensive . i think ive got the basics of my bait right.just trying to go to the next level of making an improvement.thank god ther are some guys willing to help.dont want it given on a plate just a push in the right direction .cheers.steve
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| lucilastic |
I see we have moved on to fruit......
OK....try the Noni....and the alkaloid Xeronine... Pip Pip....
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| blondie |
thats very unusual luci.also very interesting .if it has the same effect and benefit to carp with what ive read.... .cheers.steve
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| lucilastic |
I can give you no guarantee as to its efficacy Steve.....then again,I could
say the same for some current carp bait ingredients.... At the very least it appears to be "human grade" .....
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| blondie |
i agree.what are your thoughts on "betaine".there seems to be several natural forms of betaine(g.l.m ect).betaine hcl and cheaper powder forms.i would of thought a natural source would be more benefical(allthough rather expensive) .some people seem to rate it others dont .cheers.steve
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| The Hunter's Moon |
Steve
You certainly have a thrust for knowledge …..Good luck with improving your mix you must have a life time of additions to try by now……..
Luci A possibility  .. But I’m a little skeptical  …. more reading required…. perhaps 1 for another day …. I just hope they are not on the coffee, beer & ciggs as well …… my quest lies in a different direction 
Laters .. 
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| blondie |
hi hunters moon.i have too much time on my hands at the moment.off work with a slip disc and surgery required .unable to fish so swotting up on bait and trying to improve my knowledge.forum and google are my friends at the moment.cant do anything else  .apprieciate the contributions to the thread by you guys .cheers.steve
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| The Hunter's Moon |
I have sent you a PM.. it maybe of help or you may have seen it already…Good luck with the back |